ruby
New Member
Posts: 10
|
Ruby
Aug 1, 2009 15:44:13 GMT -5
Post by ruby on Aug 1, 2009 15:44:13 GMT -5
Hello all ~ I'm so glad (understatement) to have found this blog, and very inspired by Vyckie and Laura and so many of the other posters here.
Here's a rundown of my journey to date, which I hope to expand on eventually.
I was raised by my mother's family in the early 70s. My grandma was part of the feminist movement ~ she bought "Free to be You and Me" for me ~ and my aunts, who I was crazy about, were hippies. They were all wonderful to me. I believed was beautiful and lovable and cared for, and got pretty much the best start in life anyone could ask for.
My Mom married into a German Lutheran family when I was four. I attended "Christian Day School" from kindergarten through my senior year. Although I had been convinced that our synod had "the word in its truth and purity," I became disturbed by the legalism and anti-semitism I was seeing and left when I was 18 to join a "living" church. No less legalistic, but very lively worship. Unfortunately, I was unable to see the legalism for what it was.
I worked at a Christian bookstore while in college, which is where I discovered Mary Pride.
After attending a Bill Gothard Seminar during the summer of '89, I decided it must be "God's will" for me to leave college. Lucky for me, my Dad valued a higher education and I submitted to his desire for me to finish my degree.
I graduated from college and got married at about the same time, when I was 20 years old. My husband and I dated for three years, so I felt as though I knew him well. We started with an elagitarian relationship, but as we were more and more drawn in to the QF philosophy, (by way of Gothard and Pride) he pushed boundaries and I declined to enforce them.
I got pregnant two weeks after the wedding. We attemtped home birth, but pre-eclampsia prevented that. I got pregnant again seven months later, and suffered through pre-eclampsia a second time. We decided that birth control (but only a barrier method!) would be okay, because the Bible tells us to choose life ~ and mine was included in that.
Over the years, my husband was becoming more patriarchal and more irrational. (no jokes about oxymorons, now! ; ) He started his own business which I was dead-set against. This was a man who could barely take care of himself and had never balanced a checkbook, and I had serious doubts about his ability to generate a reasonable income.
Still, I finally went along with his plan and became his cheerleader / secretary. About a year into it, I had our third child and attempted a year of homeschooling with the older two.
The business failed spectacularly after 8 years of misery. He blamed the failure was on me for a variety of reasons, none of which made any sense.
Our marriage was also tanking. To him, it seemed reasonable that I could raise the children, contribute to the family's income, keep a clean house, cook every meal from scratch, work out at the Y every day to keep my cute little figure, and be an insatiable seductress when the mood struck him. Ironically, this same man wouldn't pick his own d*mn socks up off the floor, because he was tired from working all day.
When the burn-out began to be significant enough that I couldn't fake it anymore, he decided I needed "help." This was meant to be derogatory but I took him up on it anyway. A therapist who turned out to be worth her weight in gold gave me the push I needed to start thinking logically.
It took three years, but I'm finally divorced and living with my three kids. (I use the word kids deliberately, because the QF word police disapproved of it.) We're all in much better head space these days, and reclaiming our lives and our right to experience joy on a regular basis.
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 1, 2009 17:16:06 GMT -5
Post by jemand on Aug 1, 2009 17:16:06 GMT -5
Welcome! I hope you enjoy it here
|
|
lectio
Full Member
growing...
Posts: 128
|
Ruby
Aug 1, 2009 22:06:33 GMT -5
Post by lectio on Aug 1, 2009 22:06:33 GMT -5
Ruby, I relate with a lot of your story... Glad you are here.
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 1, 2009 23:38:07 GMT -5
Post by Vyckie D. Garrison on Aug 1, 2009 23:38:07 GMT -5
Ruby ~ welcome! So glad you found us here at NLQ. What a story you have ~ so familiar ~ and so many parallels. Wow. When you get a chance, I do hope you'll share with us your children's reactions to the divorce ~ were they convinced of the QF/P worldview too? And what about your relatives ~ mom, grandmother, aunt ~ it sure would be interesting to hear how they reacted to your descent into fundamentalism and your subsequent "awakening." We are working on a FAQ right now which I'm hoping to interest you in as your perspective as one who's BTDT ~ How do I leave my quiverfull life? (http://nolongerquivering.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=faq&action=display&thread=302) Please feel free to add any comments or suggestions as we want that info. to be as helpful as possible to QF women who might be considering getting out. Thanks for sharing, Ruby ~ so nice to "meet" you. Vyckie
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 2, 2009 19:16:26 GMT -5
Post by philosophia on Aug 2, 2009 19:16:26 GMT -5
Nice to meet you Ruby. I'm not around much right now, but I had to say hello!
Sincerely,
Philosophia
|
|
ruby
New Member
Posts: 10
|
Ruby
Aug 2, 2009 21:06:07 GMT -5
Post by ruby on Aug 2, 2009 21:06:07 GMT -5
Thank you all for the kind welcome.
Vyckie, you mentioned parallels. There sure are, and I'm surprised there are so many. I came across the post regarding physical ailments yesterday, and my jaw dropped at how many women chimed in with their trouble sleeping, (Lectio, I believe you mentioned your iPod. I don't know what I would do without my iPod!) their fatigue, anxiety, and there might have been some digestive problems mentioned as well.
It almost seems as though there should be a syndrome for this. I've been diagnosed with chronic fatigue, hypothyroidism, ADHD, depression ... Evidently, I'm nowhere near alone.
Also, you asked some questions. Happy to share.
1. My kids' reactions ~ by the time I filed for divorce, they were very much on board. One of the things that really got me thinking was a few years prior, when my second son said, "Mom, can't you just divorce him?" He and his Dad had been buddies up until this boy was about 13 / 14, and then Dad's attitude toward him changed drastically.
My first son is more of a bookish fellow, so his Dad's physical demonstrations scared him. He preferred to stay out of the way when his Dad was around. He's also very logical and rational and having to listen to his Dad's illogical arguments with me caused him to seriously doubt Dad's stability. When his church youth group went to see "Fireproof," he left the movie very angry. Among other observations, he said "That would never work with dad."
My daughter seemed a little torn at first, but once the divorce was in progress she witnessed some very mean displays of anger (temper tantrums?) aimed at me and my second son. They frightened her, and they also destroyed any "daddy" feelings she had for him.
Actually filing was really hard ~ I kept loosing my nerve and putting it off. The boys would ask for updates from time to time, and were antsy to get the ball rolling.
Thankfully, one could only say we were QF for few years early on so the kids weren't sold on it. The patriarchal thing though, is what got worse and worse, and they were able to see how some people's idea of what is "ideal" doesn't translate to actual life. And because I've always had a good relationship with my kids, I was able to explain things to them as we went along.
We're still Christians, but with an egalitarian view of the scriptures that is not shared by the majority. I believe its a reasonable view, (at the very least, consistent with the "God is Love" meme) but I'm fully admitting there's a lot I don't know.
Anyhoo ~ when the Dad wants to get preachy and enlighten the children on the topic of wifely submission, they're savvy enough to remind him that if he's referring to Ephesians 5, the submission is supposed to be mutual, and that "defer" would probably be more in the spirit of the text.
2. My relatives' reaction ~ this is a two-parter, so I'll talk about my Mom first.
First of all, she didn't find out about the divorce from me. My ex called her after I told him my intentions, and said that Ruby wants a divorce and I think she's suicidal. (I wasn't.) My family knew something was up, I'd lost a huge amount of weight in a short time because of the stress, but I wasn't ready yet to reveal to anybody but one sister that my perfect put-together life was anything but. As the oldest of four daughters, I had a self-imposed obligation to be the "responsible one" and couldn't bear to intrude on anybody by asking for help.
She didn't talk to me about it until that evening, and since the cat was out of the bag, I decided to tell her not everything, but a big chunk. Primarily, that he had changed and I was concerned he wasn't stable.
Since she was a co-descender into fundamentalism, I didn't have to catch her up on any of that or justify anything religiously. She did say that she wanted the best for me, and if that meant a divorce, she would support that. My parents have been amazing throughout all this.
3. My grandma and aunts ~ They were all a bit stumped by my embracing fundamentalism, but I had been a Good Lutheran for so long that it probably seemed like more of the same. I still remember being five years old and trying to explain to them that I was a sinner, and their saying "No, you're perfect!" I know they couldn't quite wrap their minds around how many children I intended to have, but since it didn't come to pass, they never brought it up. When they did disapprove of something they'd ask about it, but generally they assumed it was because of my Mom.
When I told my grandma about the divorce, she was surprised. Again, my weight loss and fatigue was obvious, but she and my aunts thought that I was still having friction with my mom. (That's a story unto itself, but the friction ended in 1998) They believed my very carefully cultivated image that my marriage was rock solid. She was instantly sympathetic because she left her abusive marriage when she was in her early 50s.
We haven't talked very much about about everything that's happened over the last couple of years. My process coincided with one of my aunt's decline and death from liver disease. We're a tight family and this was devastating.
4. Your FAQ ~ I'd love to help in any way possible. I have a background in PR and copy writing, and it would feel good to contribute.
|
|
lectio
Full Member
growing...
Posts: 128
|
Ruby
Aug 3, 2009 0:40:55 GMT -5
Post by lectio on Aug 3, 2009 0:40:55 GMT -5
Ruby, That is pretty freaky how many similarities....! I'm the oldest child, too, and the pressure to *be* the oldest, as in, have everything together and whatnot, was a hard bubble to break... My weight loss was extreme as well. It's been so good to get my body back. Almost all my wierd health things are gone.... I still have a very painful scalp...like it's bruised all over, only it's not...I don't get what that is at all and neither did any of hte docters, either...and I do get muscle tics every now and then but NOTHING like what it was like before...and every once in a while a few of the other symptoms flare up, but I'm mostly about 90% improved, which is a faster recovery than I thought it would be...I was told it would be at least 2 years, if I was stress-free (ha), and even then, perhaps I'd never make a full recovery. Just too much adrenalin coursing through my veins for too long... Oh yes, and the sleep thing...good old ipod. That does the trick... I'm in the very first tentative baby steps of the process of extracating myself from all of this, legally, and it's very hard...I mostly know that I'm going to, but still can't help doing the "wish it could be better" stuff...less and less as I go, though. It's gone from "what if I could make it work somehow..." to an "I wish it could have...but I know it can't..."
|
|
jeb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
|
Ruby
Aug 3, 2009 5:42:31 GMT -5
Post by jeb on Aug 3, 2009 5:42:31 GMT -5
Reading histories like yours lectio and yours ruby just sadden me to the core especially when family rejection is part of the package. I grew up in the Church of God headquartered in Anderson, Indiana. And here's a funny side note to that: When I was in business in Hattiesburg, MS in the 80s there was a chap that came in for one of my clients to order window screens for the rental units my client owned. He informed me that he was Church of God too and while I hadn't been for some time I told him that that was nice. And then he informed me that the difference between me and him though was that the church he belonged to didn't have it's headquarters in Indiana. No indeed, his Church of God had it's headquarters in Heaven. And then he stated further that I couldn't possibly know the joy that he had in his heart. When I asked him if he didn't think I had joy in my heart his reply was that while I might have SOME joy in my heart I couldn't possibly have the kind of joy that he had because I didn't belong to his Church of God. I even managed to keep a straight face through all of that. Anyway, In 1956 I came down to the states from Toronto and went to work at The Gospel Trumpet Co. . . . the publishing house for the Church of God in Anderson. There was a beautiful German girl working there that in her job moved around through the various departments and when she walked in to where I worked it was like a ray of sunshine had just come into the room. That girl, Katie was her name if memory serves, was so full of joy it was contagious. Everybody responded to her with delight she shone that bright. And then one day, the light went out. This girl had made a terrible mistake . . . she'd fallen in love with a CATHOLIC . . . . OMG!!!!!! And her good, German, Christian, Church of God father had tossed her out of the house. He told her that his daughter had died . . . that she was no longer alive to him. And her light was snuffed. I moved on from there shortly thereafter so I don't know the final outcome of that story but . . . that was one of the biggest eyeopeners in my life on how people do terrible things to others, even their families, in the name of Jesus and his love. And on another occasion, several years later, I witnessed another sad commentary on the same theme. I was living in San Jose, CA and was the shipping supervisor for The Warner press . . . the publishing arm of The Gospel Trumpet Company. (The Gospel Trumpet was the church magazine for many years. Last I heard it was called Vital Christianity) We attended the Church of God in San Jose and there was a beautiful, senior, black gentleman that attended that church who reminded me a lot of the German girl back in Anderson . . . he absolutely shone. He always had a brilliant smile and a 'So Happy to See You' joy about him that one couldn't help but respond in kind. Except that there was a family that had moved to CA from Georgia (remember that this was the early 60s) and when this beautiful person greeted them on the steps of the church and proffered his hand in fellowship, this hate filled (but good Christian) white man just glared at him and I watched the light go out to be replaced by unbearable pain. Having lived, briefly, in MS ( 58 - 61 ) I knew what prejudice looked like and I knew that some Christians justified their less than loving views of African Americans from/by the Bible but I had never seen such hateful behaviour demonstrated so dramatically as in that moment. Christians are supposed to be family, right? ? ? ? are supposed to be brothers and sisters to one another? Forget it . . that's true only if you look like, act like, talk like and think like one another. If by birth or choice or happenstance you appear to be different . . . it ain't gonna happen. I know, I know, one can't make generalizations like that but after viewing any number of instances of this kind of cruel and unseemly behaviour I decided that I could be an even better person if I just stepped away from all of that. So I divorced the church. I can be more loving (or hateful as the case may be) on my own. I think that's a choice we can all make without any help from organized religion. I've gone on longer then I planned but the histories here do bring old memories to life, eh? Y'all treat yourselves (and others) lovingly, eh? John
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 3, 2009 12:35:31 GMT -5
Post by tapati on Aug 3, 2009 12:35:31 GMT -5
Welcome, Ruby, and thanks for telling your story, painful as it is. I'm glad you have a supportive family behind you.
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 3, 2009 12:36:55 GMT -5
Post by tapati on Aug 3, 2009 12:36:55 GMT -5
JEB, what amazing stories.
I would like to think, however, that the light was merely dimmed and that it came back full force when these two people got away from the prejudices of their abusers.
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 4, 2009 7:54:23 GMT -5
Post by sargassosea on Aug 4, 2009 7:54:23 GMT -5
Welcome, Ruby! I'm so glad you're here to help 'heal and be healed' as someone around here is fond of saying Constantly in awe of you ladies...
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 5, 2009 10:27:50 GMT -5
Post by kisekileia on Aug 5, 2009 10:27:50 GMT -5
"reclaiming our lives and our right to experience joy on a regular basis"
This really resonates with me, Ruby, even as someone who was evangelical but never QF. Joy rooted in God and love was encouraged in evangelicalism, and it was one of the main reasons I became a Christian. But later on, especially in my twenties when I started making friends with some fairly libertine types, I realized that an awful lot of other forms of joy weren't allowed in evangelical Christianity. I'd bought the lies that there was no real joy in things that were "ungodly", and it took me a long time to realize that keeping joy from going bad simply requires responsibility, not repression.
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 6, 2009 18:13:42 GMT -5
Post by arietty on Aug 6, 2009 18:13:42 GMT -5
Welcome Ruby, and thank you for sharing your story My first son is more of a bookish fellow, so his Dad's physical demonstrations scared him. He preferred to stay out of the way when his Dad was around. He's also very logical and rational and having to listen to his Dad's illogical arguments with me caused him to seriously doubt Dad's stability. When his church youth group went to see "Fireproof," he left the movie very angry. Among other observations, he said "That would never work with dad." Indeed that is very familiar "that would never work with Dad". Maybe some of that stuff (I haven't seen the film) "works" with normal people but many of us married to men with huge problems know it doesn't work. My ex's agendas in life were not fixable by applying any of these formulas because he actually didn't want to be in a healthy loving relationship. He wanted to be in control and to make himself feel good by demeaning everyone so he could be the superior one. This played out in all his relationships.
|
|
|
Ruby
Aug 6, 2009 18:20:05 GMT -5
Post by arietty on Aug 6, 2009 18:20:05 GMT -5
In a weird way, the rejection from my family has almost been harder to take than my marriage dying. I think it was so painful because it was such a surprise...I always thought they'd be there for me, but it turned out that the support was there as long as the perfect family facade was in place. The good christian woman holds that facade together, no matter waht the cost...even if the cost is herself. It has been deeply hurtful and I'm not sure if I'll ever get over it. In this weird way, I feel like an orphan. There are more details, but it just gets weirder and would make me angry to even talk about. It was just quite an unexpected turn of events, I'll just put it like that, and my gender factors heavily into the equation. So I'm on my own. That is how I felt about my rejection from my church. It was a pain that I still struggle with long after the divorce (11 years after..) I have no real family to speak of and I know I tended to look on church as family even though I knew this was a bit of fiction. When the divorce happened I had 2 friends left, both of whom were divorced themselves. I was very isolated. I am sorry your family couldn't rally round you Molly Looking back I cannot fathom WHY I ever thought my church would still be my community after I divorced, but I naively thought so. I would think expecting this from family would be even more natural. I know my own losses are not something I will get over, rather they are a part of me forever.
|
|