mymmeli

[mymmeli]

Hi everyone,

I'm another godless feminist on these boards. Efforts were made by my grandparents to raise me and my brother as Catholics (I'm Polish), but it never took hold, partly because we went to live in secular England for7 years in my childhood.

I've been fascinated by the patriocentric movement ever since I came across it, first through Ladies Against Feminism and then through different blogs. It blew my mind, as while I've seen lots of antifeminist backlash I'd never really encountered such radical opinions (all skirts, no votes, no working outside the home etc), at least in the Western world. I've also been creeped out by the fact that the whole thing looks so alluring - I've been drawn to this way of life, slightly.

I think this is also the first time that I've been thankful to live in a predominantly Catholic country. While the Church teaching on women doesn't appeal to me (to put it mildly), it's nowhere as extreme as patriocentricity, and should ensure that the other movement never catches on. Although I've been seeing some worrying signs - should Douglas Wilson's teachings be something to be anxious about?

All that said, and while I believe that patriocentricity is generally bad (and leads to such abuses of power as evidenced by Vickie's and Laura's stories), I've learned a lot through reading QF/patriarchal blogs and seeing different perspectives on things. And I think it's a really good thing that people with such differing views can talk on this forum.

[arietty]

Hey mymmeli! If you get a chance could you tell us what you find alluring about the QF stuff you've looked at, and what "draws you slightly" at times? It has been quite validating for me to read people say that kind of thing because if folks who aren't brainwashed find some appeal at times to this lifestyle it doesn't seem quite so insane to me that I did. I am still trying to work out all the elements as to what the allure was.. like was there actually anything GOOD about it? Sure elements are just fine but it's not the elements (which are doable by anyone) that appeals, it's the whole package deal.

[mymmeli]

That's a hard question Partly because analysing one's reactions is challenging, partly because the patrio movement is so diverse. I don't find every type appealing and I'm not sure that I find the "whole package deal" appealing.

A lot of it is the pretty pictures of big, happy families (only one sibling here, and I don't personally know a single family with more than 3 children...) in elegant clothes with fairytale weddings. The regency dresses. The headcoverings, which I'd hate to wear regularly, but some have a real charm to them.
It would be nice not to have to bother with taking the pill every day.
Then there's the simple life, back to basics agrarian thing. No idea how I'd deal with going all the way to farming/homesteading, but baking my own bread, canning etc is something I'd like to do but can't really justify it timewise.
The submission thing, because making decisions is hard work sometimes, and having someone to do this could make life easier.
Stay-at-homeing currently has its appeal too, as on the surface it beats sending out CVs or sitting in an office!
The home churches look like a very close-knit community, something I think is lacking in Poland, at least in the cities.

That's a loose jumble of thoughts, but I'd say what appeals to me is the shiny packaging plus a few elements, which, as you say, would be doable by anyone. On the other hand is the ideology and religion which is the reason for the movement doesn't appeal to me at all, though I find myself thinking that getting [this type of] religion might be okay if I could live a perfect patrio lifestyle.

[anotheramy]

Hi!

There is some evidence of strong patriarchal ideas infiltrating the Catholicism in America. Here's a link to one example - talibanrising.blogspot.com/2009/03/view-from-inside-mental-burqa.html

Hopefully it does not turn into a trend.

[arietty]

anotheramy it's already a big Catholic trend. Opus Dei people are into it.

I went to a Catholic homeschooling conference once and met some wonderful people. They were all latin rite Catholics and virulently anti-feminism and their literature was pretty much the same stuff as in the protestant patrio movement, but with a heavy Catholic overlay.

mymelli thanks for you great reply!! Yes I can get all of that. There has to be some way to identify the needs this allure appeals to and to meet them outside of the fundamentalism

[tapati]

Hi, Mymmeli!

Always good to have another godless feminist on board. I'm a goddessy feminist, I guess, LOL.

I agree that these groups (including the Hare Krishnas, which I was once involved with) can put on a nice, shiny presentation that makes it seem like the answer for young women who aren't sure yet what their values are and where they fit into the world.

Like that nice shiny apple with the worms inside...

[mymmeli]

Arietty and anotheramy, I hadn't come across that before. I have seen isolated blogs by patrio Catholics, but they all linked to the same Protestant teachers.

Tapati, the strange thing for me is that it's not only young women who are buying into it, at least initially. I've seen quite a few comments by women with adult families who wanted to start living this way, or felt inadequate because they didn't measure up to the standards they saw on blogs.